Been doing some thinking based on past posts and on the new MTH Tinplate catalog. I keep hearing that the Hiawatha and Vandy were both dead weight for Lionel and are sitting on store shelves. I can't think of a train store in a 100 Mile radius that has these on the shelves (I can only think of one store in New York, New Jersey and Connecticut that have one of each).
I have the Vandy and Hiawatha, that's almost $4k worth of trains. I'm confused, how are these sets a failure? I can only find about 6 of each set on the internet. How are these failures? Lionel didn't sell out of these 6 weeks after they shipped? MTH seems to be doing fine - their tinplate catalog is extensive.
What makes me sad is that these are GREAT sets. Some of the best in standard gauge. Lionel shouldn't short change themselves and their customers. You have to stay in a market to make money in the market.
I have seen this about 1000 times as I have worked in big companies for almost 20 years. Dip your toe in the water, if solid gold blocks don't fall at your feet, run in the other direction.
Trust me Lionel, I buy your standard gauge stuff. Make good stuff and I guarantee others will follow. MTH and super high quality/no compromise independent folks like Joe Mania & MEW are keeping the market going, further entry into the market will expand it. A little competition isn't a bad thing.
And let's be realistic, the only competition in the standard gauge market comes at a train meet between two dealers selling the same thing four tables away from each other. And they usually end up trading each other a ton of stuff anyway and walk away happy as clams.
Try making a standard gauge Blue Streak. I promise, I'll buy two.
M
5 comments:
Marc, can you point me toward one of these CV sets? I'm trying to find one to purchase.
Thanks,
Jim Kelly
Vandy
I looked at the Vandy but I didn't buy one. I felt it wouldn't fit in with my other trains, mostly all classic period. I had a DeHanes Santa Fe set for a while and it just looked out of place displayed with my other trains. I thought the Vandy would be the same thing. I thought about the Hiawatha and if I see one cheap at a show I will pick it up.
One of the things I think MTH does right is that they offer trains in both traditional and contemporary. I am a traditionalist. I like the feel, smell, and sound of the original style motors. The Can motors just don't have the same mechanical feel for me.
I have one complaint about Lionels recent tinplate offerings, they change things just a little bit. I bought the terrace and station a little while back. Lionel decided to put 4 screws on the top of the terrace. I would have much prefered if they had made it exactly like the original. If they had to add the screws they could have put them under the station. I passed on the power station and the Hellgate because they did the same thing. They added the smoke to the power staion and plastic windows to the Hellgate. To be honest though I have a power station and 2 Hellgates so I didn't need them. I did not have a terrace and the price was good. Also I liked the the fact that it says Lionel City over the door.
If Lionel and MTH reproduced the same item for the same price, I would buy the Lionel version every time. Just because I would rather have my cars and engines lettered Lionel Lines like the originals. but if one differs from the original I will probably buy the one that doesn't. Just my humble oppinion. Tom
Jim,
Just do a search on "Lionel Standard Gauge Commodore Vanderbilt" on Google. You'll come up with at least 5 dealers that have them online.
I agree that the current Lionel reproductions aren't quite the same as the standard gauge originals. Honestly though, I am rarely concerned about the accuracy anyway, as long as it is a close shot at the product. The reason being is that I know manufacturing has changed and they may know some things they didn't know in the 30's and 40's.
Further, I also know the option is for Lionel/MTH to produce nothing at all. They could just as well produce more scale o gauge stuff for 1200 bucks an engine and more postwar reproductions. We (people that run standard)just don't represent a large dollar number, even if the products do have better margins.
Tom, I agree, I tend to like having the lionel name on the item as well. Although there is a growing movement in the tinplate hobby to produce "no compromises" products. I think the vendors will start to feel this sooner than later. No comromises means that the products are exactly like the originals with every bolt, screw and driver in the right place. I have quite a few no compromises pieces and I have to tell you, I'm not that picky, I really am glad to have both.
Marc
Marc,
I would dive on a Hiawatha if it were available. The other comments lead me to believe this is not a hopeless quest.
I also would like to see Lionel further pursue the Standard Gauge reproduction market. I would like to add that the Hiawatha and Vanderbilt were not the end of the line. Lionel did produce a reproduction of the #128 station and terrace as of the 2003 volume II and Polar Express catalogs. I have the red trim model on my layout and am very happy with it.
Should Lionel continue (and I hope they do so), I would encourage Standard Gauge with a Command/TMCC option and RailSounds. Recently, I purchased an MTH No.9 Pay-As-You-Enter Trolley with conventional motor and electronics. It has the same programmable station stop feature as the MTH subway sets; this adds a lot of interest. I think Lionel could do as well with command and sound.
Thanks,
Tom Virgil (aka San Diegan)
Please direct me to 1:32 scale train sets & modeling; figures & accessories. brent.cairns@za.didata.com
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